What do you think about the mod?

Questions, opinions or general chatter regarding MR.
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ardent
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Sun Feb 26, 2012 2:54 am

Sula wrote:Not played demo cause I wait for finished product and don't wanna to play only a part of adventure :)
I agree with Pixote - check out the demo. The game still has a long ways to go (really long), so at least you can have a glimpse of what it will look like in the end, and it will also give you a little something to do while we work on finishing the mod. :mhmm:
One thing I am concerned with - scripts are ready in 46% only at least that what website is saying and usually in mod projects that is what take longest time :(
Actually, it says 42% :ugly: And yeah - scripting takes long, but writing takes even longer and we're low on writers, so this is our biggest issue atm. Fortunately, we have a new, talented scripter working for us, so hopefully progress in this respect will be faster.
Anyway good luck - I hope MR will finally arrive after all those years.
Thanks for support and don't worry - MR will ship, although it won't happen tomorrow (or even next week).
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MR Mutant
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Thu Mar 15, 2012 3:04 pm

The demo is good. Have an old good climate. I'd list my reflections.

* New graphics are promising, I'd hope that intro is also a demo version though. ;) The challenge is that it should fit ideally. For example: Pip-Boy is great, cup of coffee - pixels and rushes there. Also, good theme song (but with clicking sounds?).
* The one main plot for a city makes it seem to be an episode, even better than in F1 (which is very consistent, F2 - a little chaotic). It would be good for the whole game.
* It's funny that Cassidy runs the same dive as usual (and is afraid about going to the cave with rats. Rats can't be on the same ground as giant ants btw, because they'd probably kill themselves for food.)
* The character should start the game in some villager outfit, he even have no shoes!
Last edited by MR Mutant on Fri Mar 16, 2012 10:44 am, edited 1 time in total.

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ardent
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Thu Mar 15, 2012 3:24 pm

MR Mutant wrote:The demo is good. Has an old good climate.
Thanks.
* New graphics are promising, I'd hope that intro is also a demo version though. ;)
Which intro? The "war never changes" one or the "Elko" intro? And why?
Also, good theme song (but with clicking sounds?)
The keyboard sounds over the tribal beat reflect that Elko was built together by Vault dwellers/Wastelanders (modern) and Arroyans (tribal).
The one main plot for a city makes it seem to be an episode, even better than in F1 (which is very consistent, F2 - a little chaotic). It would be good for the whole game.
I didn't quite understand that. Do you mean that the town has a prevailing plotline with unrelated sidequests? If so, then yeah, basically every location has main quests that influence the fate of the town and side quests which most often have little impact on how the town fares in the end.
* It's funny that Cassidy runs the same dive as usual
?
and is afraid about going to the cave with rats
Maybe he's not really afraid. Maybe he only tests your courage? Or maybe he can feel his heart failing and doesn't feel comfortable in damp, hot, underground corridors?
Rats can't be on the same ground as giant ants btw, because they'd probably kill themselves for food.
And rats alone wouldn't kill each other for food?
The character should start the game in some villager outfit, he even have no shoes!
Your character does actually start in a villager outfit :scratch:
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MR Mutant
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Thu Mar 15, 2012 3:43 pm

* New graphics are promising, I'd hope that intro is also a demo version though. ;)
Which intro? The "war never changes" one or the "Elko" intro? And why?
"Elko"? This bad 3D. Screens are okay.
Also, good theme song (but with clicking sounds?)
The keyboard sounds over the tribal beat reflect that Elko was built together by Vault dwellers/Wastelanders (modern) and Arroyans (tribal).
Good, the town is rather wasteland climate though.
The one main plot for a city makes it seem to be an episode, even better than in F1 (which is very consistent, F2 - a little chaotic). It would be good for the whole game.
I didn't quite understand that. Do you mean that the town has a prevailing plotline with unrelated sidequests? If so, then yeah, basically every location has main quests that influence the fate of the town and side quests which most often have little impact on how the town fares in the end.
It's like a book: very straight and certain, which is good. (F1 was similar, F2 a little chaotic with all its threads and side quests).
* It's funny that Cassidy runs the same dive as usual
?
Obviously, he was met in VC in some slum and there he runs some slum.
and is afraid about going to the cave with rats
Maybe he's not really afraid. Maybe he only tests your courage? Or maybe he can feel his heart failing and doesn't feel comfortable in damp, hot, underground corridors?
Rather not. ;)
Rats can't be on the same ground as giant ants btw, because they'd probably kill themselves for food.
And rats alone wouldn't kill each other for food?
I don't know.
The character should start the game in some villager outfit, he even have no shoes!
Your character does actually start in a villager outfit :scratch:
In a tribal outfit, whatever it's called.

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ardent
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Thu Mar 15, 2012 4:00 pm

MR Mutant wrote:"Elko"? This bad 3D. Screens are okay.
Oh, this. This is the ancient logo from before the last two teams :heh: We kept it for sentimental reasons. Little chance of it changing though - we have no 3D animators.
Good, the town is rather wasteland climate though.
Yeah, it did fit a little better in the original version of Elko, with the Vault and everything. But we don't have the source files anymore.
It's like a book: very straight and certain, which is good. (F1 was similar, F2 a little chaotic with all its threads and side quests).
Well, Elko is the most "railroaded" location of the game, because it's the starting location and not much could be done multiple choice-wise. Other towns are more free-roaming, so you may get more of the "Fallout 2 impression". You'll see for yourself when the game is out, I hope you'll like it.
Obviously, he was met in VC in some slum and there he runs some slum.
You can't teach an old dog new tricks, they say. Or: what goes around always comes around. :smil2:
Maybe he's not really afraid. Maybe he only tests your courage? Or maybe he can feel his heart failing and doesn't feel comfortable in damp, hot, underground corridors?
Rather not. ;)
Nobody's perfect.
And rats alone wouldn't kill each other for food?
I don't know.
Then let's keep it like it is for the sake of variety and to save time.
In a tribal outfit, whatever it's called.
You do realise how long it takes to make a new playable character model? If you don't, it takes months. This time is better spent on other things. After all, you only wear the tribal outfit for like 2 hours or so.
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MR Mutant
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Fri Mar 16, 2012 9:09 am

ardent wrote:Oh, this. This is the ancient logo from before the last two teams :heh: We kept it for sentimental reasons. Little chance of it changing though - we have no 3D animators.
Yeah, it seems old school. I love the climate of PC games from 96-97 and so on. Too bad you don't have 3D animators, perhaps it could be easily done: depends on scenario.
[...] town is rather wasteland climate though.
Yeah, it did fit a little better in the original version of Elko, with the Vault and everything. But we don't have the source files anymore.
Elko is accurate, what can one do with this damn Geck; although, according to F2 ending, it would b rather flourishing community. It is similar with F2 and F1: Arroyans using spears when VD could handle anything in the wastes. He may jilt it anyway and just didn't want to tell. (In F1 outro there is only a gun; it gives something to imagination, e.g. sneaky destroying of MB). On the second thought: in the Elder briefing she have a Magnum, so he just wanted to be something new.
Well, Elko is the most "railroaded" location of the game, because it's the starting location and not much could be done multiple choice-wise. Other towns are more free-roaming, so you may get more of the "Fallout 2 impression". You'll see for yourself when the game is out, I hope you'll like it.
If it's well done. ;)
You can't teach an old dog new tricks, they say. Or: what goes around always comes around. :smil2:
Nobody's perfect.
And rats alone wouldn't kill each other for food?
I don't know.
Then let's keep it like it is for the sake of variety and to save time.
Rats rather wouldn't kill each other if they aren't starving etc., it is more possible they'd together kill some ants...
You do realise how long it takes to make a new playable character model? If you don't, it takes months. This time is better spent on other things. After all, you only wear the tribal outfit for like 2 hours or so.
Months? The most difficult is probably to keep the style. (Even in F2 there were only a few new models: monsters, humans and that's all.)

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Jinx
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Fri Mar 16, 2012 4:19 pm

Glad you're taking interest in the MOD friend :mhmm:
MR Mutant wrote:Yeah, it seems old school. I love the climate of PC games from 96-97 and so on. Too bad you don't have 3D animators, perhaps it could be easily done: depends on scenario.
Oh, we all do :mhmm:
MR Mutant wrote:Elko is accurate, what can one do with this damn Geck; although, according to F2 ending, it would b rather flourishing community. It is similar with F2 and F1: Arroyans using spears when VD could handle anything in the wastes. He may jilt it anyway and just didn't want to tell. (In F1 outro there is only a gun; it gives something to imagination, e.g. sneaky destroying of MB). On the second thought: in the Elder briefing she have a Magnum, so he just wanted to be something new.
The reason for Elko not being a state-of-the-art utopia which the GECK would very likely assist in creating is because the GECK was used to re-form Arroyo after FO2. Elko is the result of the Chosen One wanting to start anew somewhere fresh, as his grandfater the Vault Dweller did so many years ago. Elko is the result of restored pre-war ruins, tribal knowledge and wastelander know-how being combined. Very little from the GECK was used (Chosen One only brought a handful of seeds and a few schematics basically).
MR Mutant wrote:If it's well done. ;)
[cue Yoda voice] Oh it will be... It will be...
MR Mutant wrote:Rats rather wouldn't kill each other if they aren't starving etc., it is more possible they'd together kill some ants...
The main source of nourishment for the critters down in the tunnels are fungi, roots, lichen and, well, corpses from the graveyard above. They aren't starving, so the rats avoid the bigger ants, and the ants aren't really threatened by the rats. Thus = teneous co-existance (as long as said food doesn't run out, true).
MR Mutant wrote:Months? The most difficult is probably to keep the style. (Even in F2 there were only a few new models: monsters, humans and that's all.)
The reason why it would be months is because you need to create the model for EVERY type of weapon, or at least the ones available in Elko. A lot of the original models only have art done for a small array of weaponry, being unable to equip anything else. Example: you'll never see a trucker-cap townie wielding a minigun, because there isn't any art to support it and such art would take a 2d artis a lot of time to make. It's a technical issue :dead:
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MR Mutant
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Sat Mar 17, 2012 8:33 am

Jinx wrote:The reason why it would be months is because you need to create the model for EVERY type of weapon, or at least the ones available in Elko. A lot of the original models only have art done for a small array of weaponry, being unable to equip anything else. Example: you'll never see a trucker-cap townie wielding a minigun, because there isn't any art to support it and such art would take a 2d artis a lot of time to make. It's a technical issue :dead:
And wielding a knife or a gun? Never mind.

Kisieli
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Sun Mar 18, 2012 9:46 pm

I've recently started looking for Fallout 2 mods and found this one. I was very intrigued by it's name so I thought that It will be worth checking out...And it was! :D
It's awesome *-* I hope it really gets finished :)

As for suggestions:
1.I don't know how it will look in full version but in Elko there's kinda strange thing about doing mainstream quest ^^" When You have to find what "triggers" toxin, you have to speak to Morlis *That woman in council* and she is the one to give you information...With only expection that I've already got that information from Vrax like 30 mins ago while I was exploring Arroyoans part of Elko... Maybe it would be better to make gathering information in quests more flexible, so you won't have to talk to one and only person pointed out by script even if you can get the same information from other people ? :)

2.In 640x400 resolution there are graphic glitches ^^" Very minor bug but I noticed it when I forgot to turn on 1024x800 ^^"

If I notice anything else I'll post it here
Ah and just wanted to ask whether our possible sex partner *that Arroyan girl with whom we can sleep* survives the attack?That "Wrong feeling" after that act made me wonder. xD

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ardent
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Sun Mar 18, 2012 10:07 pm

Kisieli wrote:I've recently started looking for Fallout 2 mods and found this one. I was very intrigued by it's name so I thought that It will be worth checking out...And it was! :D
It's awesome *-* I hope it really gets finished :)
Thank you for the kind words, we're really glad you liked it :smil2:
1.I don't know how it will look in full version but in Elko there's kinda strange thing about doing mainstream quest ^^" When You have to find what "triggers" toxin, you have to speak to Morlis *That woman in council* and she is the one to give you information...With only expection that I've already got that information from Vrax like 30 mins ago while I was exploring Arroyoans part of Elko... Maybe it would be better to make gathering information in quests more flexible, so you won't have to talk to one and only person pointed out by script even if you can get the same information from other people ? :)
You can obtain the Arroyan rites information from Vrax and it is as valid, as if you talked to Morlis. So even though Vrax might tell you that you must talk to Morlis, you can actually convince him to give you the information you're looking for. And it doesn't even matter if you do it before getting the quest to find the trigger effect or not.
2.In 640x400 resolution there are graphic glitches ^^" Very minor bug but I noticed it when I forgot to turn on 1024x800 ^^"
What kind of glitches? Can you post a screenshot?
Ah and just wanted to ask whether our possible sex partner *that Arroyan girl with whom we can sleep* survives the attack?That "Wrong feeling" after that act made me wonder. xD
No, Kirki is one of the first to be killed in the mutant attack. The answer to why you were feeling "wrong" after having sex with her will be hinted on at a later time in the game.
MR Mutant wrote:And wielding a knife or a gun? Never mind.
Dude, making a new playable character, even with a limited number of animations is very long and painful because:
* The most basic set of animations (no fancy deaths, no weapons) is about 16 animations. Each animation has six directions and 11 frames on average. So 66 individual images. Times 16.
* Since it's a playable character, you need more animations - some weapons (each is about 8 animations). In Elko that would be at least the knife and the spear.
* You also need all the fancy death animations, because it's the player character we're talking about here. This amounts to about 28 more animations.

It's 60 animations total. The most skilled critter-builders, such as Pixote, can do, thanks to automated processes and great experience, one direction of an animation (as a reminder - each animation has 6 directions) in about 30 minutes. There are 60 animations times 6 directions, it's 180 hours. And now you also have to make the female character, so it's 360 hours. It's more than two weeks of non-stop work (24/7). Considering this is a free project, made in our free time for no monetary gain, we can only spare like about 1-2 hours daily without our wives kicking our asses. So that would be about half a year to make a critter which you will see for 2 hours of gameplay. There are better things to do with this time.
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Kisieli
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Sun Mar 18, 2012 10:27 pm

Ah for that number 2 I think it's false alarm ^^" Sorry I just noticed that DX-9 mode was turned off and that caused screen to show some random colours in animations ^^" I guess It wasn't resolution thing... Sorry for that

And as for that getting information in quests: It's that I got that information from Vrax even before I was asked by Doctor Feng to search for information about "trigger" in food.And when I was asked by Feng to get information about trigger I couldn't do it right away but I had to go to Morlis to that information which I already had from Vrax ^^" *It's kinda complicated* It's like my character forgot what Vrax told him... But it's really minor thing :)
It would be nice if information we get before even getting the quest could come handy while doing it ^^" So we do not have to repeat process of talking to people just to get that script about getting information "triggered" which will allow us to continue script :)
Overall rest is great :D I will play it once more tommorow to make sure :boing:

Ah I forgot to say it before. Music from Elko is great ;D

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ardent
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Sun Mar 18, 2012 10:48 pm

Kisieli wrote:Ah for that number 2 I think it's false alarm ^^" Sorry I just noticed that DX-9 mode was turned off and that caused screen to show some random colours in animations ^^" I guess It wasn't resolution thing... Sorry for that
No problem. You can get rid of the colour problem, if you set the hi-res patch to output 32-bit colour (enter the graphic options screen and the rest will be obvious).
And as for that getting information in quests: It's that I got that information from Vrax even before I was asked by Doctor Feng to search for information about "trigger" in food.And when I was asked by Feng to get information about trigger I couldn't do it right away but I had to go to Morlis to that information which I already had from Vrax ^^" *It's kinda complicated* It's like my character forgot what Vrax told him... But it's really minor thing :)
It would be nice if information we get before even getting the quest could come handy while doing it ^^" So we do not have to repeat process of talking to people just to get that script about getting information "triggered" which will allow us to continue script :)
I just tested it, and I'm 100% sure that if you talk to Vrax about it before getting the quest from Feng, you don't need to talk to anyone about it later. Your character remembers this information, and you can use it directly when talking to Feng.
BTW, are you playing the patched version (version 1.1) ?
Ah I forgot to say it before. Music from Elko is great ;D
Glad you like it and thanks for the props!
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Kisieli
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Sun Mar 18, 2012 11:08 pm

Ah I didn't patch it so I guess I'm playing teh 1.0 version ^^" I'll download patch tommorow and check if teh quest is okay :)

MR Mutant
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Wed Mar 21, 2012 3:19 pm

ardent wrote:
MR Mutant wrote:And wielding a knife or a gun? Never mind.
Dude, making a new playable character, even with a limited number of animations is very long and painful because:
* The most basic set of animations (no fancy deaths, no weapons) is about 16 animations. Each animation has six directions and 11 frames on average. So 66 individual images. Times 16.
* Since it's a playable character, you need more animations - some weapons (each is about 8 animations). In Elko that would be at least the knife and the spear.
* You also need all the fancy death animations, because it's the player character we're talking about here. This amounts to about 28 more animations.

It's 60 animations total. The most skilled critter-builders, such as Pixote, can do, thanks to automated processes and great experience, one direction of an animation (as a reminder - each animation has 6 directions) in about 30 minutes. There are 60 animations times 6 directions, it's 180 hours. And now you also have to make the female character, so it's 360 hours. It's more than two weeks of non-stop work (24/7). Considering this is a free project, made in our free time for no monetary gain, we can only spare like about 1-2 hours daily without our wives kicking our asses. So that would be about half a year to make a critter which you will see for 2 hours of gameplay. There are better things to do with this time.
Okay, I only asked if there is any proper (possibly playable) critter in the original F2's source files. I've seen some new critters in the modding community but, in fact, only remanufacturing, for example new colors and severe new animations. Anyway, if even done it should make sense as in the whole new artwork of game and I didn't say that one new critter would. ;) It just seem funny to me that the guy is tribal.

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gaspard
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Thu Mar 22, 2012 2:28 am

PC did grow up in a warm climate and lots of other half-naked tribal kids running around the canyonside :roll: Heck, I'd go naked!

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Fri Mar 23, 2012 12:58 pm

I played the demo some time ago (even though I initially wanted to save the surprise for the final version), and I fucking loved it!!

Cassidy was so awesome... I look forward to seeing more such high quality talking heads. Good lord you guys, just superb! The quests had a true falloutish feeling, as they could be completed in many distinct ways. As for the characters, I especially loved the slaughterman. He reminded me of the tough-ass son-of-a-bitch -type you would encounter in the original Fallouts. I played a diplomatic female pacifist (like I always do), and I found it fun as hell. Elko felt like a dreamy town you would like to grow up in. All in all, this is the sort of quality I did not expect to see! Now, with my meager graphic contribution, I feel like I am participating in a truly worthy project. Thank you for this!

Few cons:
- Cassidy's voice clips were very silent, and I had to turn my speakers up to hear what he was saying.
- I read somewhere that the tribal charset may wield the sledgehammer. Maybe make it purchaseable in the mayor's store, for more variation in combat styles?
- As I played a highly charismatic female, I found that some NPC's did not react in the proper way, and in some extreme cases even regarded me as "dude" or "man"... Maybe it was a figure of speech merely, but still... The only instance of gender-specific content I found (if I remember correctly) was that you could call the bankrobber in Cassidy's bar a pervert.


With love,
Skye

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ardent
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Fri Mar 23, 2012 1:25 pm

Skye_Sken wrote:I played the demo some time ago (even though I initially wanted to save the surprise for the final version), and I fucking loved it!!

Cassidy was so awesome... I look forward to seeing more such high quality talking heads. Good lord you guys, just superb! The quests had a true falloutish feeling, as they could be completed in many distinct ways. As for the characters, I especially loved the slaughterman. He reminded me of the tough-ass son-of-a-bitch -type you would encounter in the original Fallouts. I played a diplomatic female pacifist (like I always do), and I found it fun as hell. Elko felt like a dreamy town you would like to grow up in. All in all, this is the sort of quality I did not expect to see! Now, with my meager graphic contribution, I feel like I am participating in a truly worthy project. Thank you for this!
Thanks! :smil2: I'm very happy you had some good time with it.
- Cassidy's voice clips were very silent, and I had to turn my speakers up to hear what he was saying.
I don't know, they sounded loud enough for me - are you sure your voice volume settings weren't down? In any case, we did normalize the files before putting them in-game, but I guess they could still be pumped up. Unfortunately, there's hardly anyone on the team with some proper audio know-how. :scratch:
- I read somewhere that the tribal charset may wield the sledgehammer. Maybe make it purchaseable in the mayor's store, for more variation in combat styles?
Sledgehammer is too powerful a weapon to appear this early in the game. But if somebody did the club animations for the tribal critter, there could be clubs. :mhmm:
- As I played a highly charismatic female, I found that some NPC's did not react in the proper way, and in some extreme cases even regarded me as "dude" or "man"... Maybe it was a figure of speech merely, but still... The only instance of gender-specific content I found (if I remember correctly) was that you could call the bankrobber in Cassidy's bar a pervert.
Examples of characters treating you as male even though you're a female are bugs, so if you can pinpoint any, we'll be greatful. I know that there are characters addressing you as "man" ("hey man, thanks a bunch!" type talk), but that's not incorrect, even when said to a girl.
There is much more gender-specific content in the demo. Morlis is a good example (try talking to her if you're a guy - not so nice and smooth anymore). Also, the interactions with the Trenches are different depending on your gender. Young Tom Corben will react to you differently when you're doing O'Hara's quest. There is one quest that goes separate ways for male and female dumb characters. There are special interactions available with Kirki if you're male, but not if you're female. Plenty of characters have different lines depending on your gender. Etc.
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gaspard
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Sat Mar 24, 2012 4:02 am

ardent wrote:Sledgehammer is too powerful a weapon to appear this early in the game. But if somebody did the club animations for the tribal critter, there could be clubs. :mhmm:
Red crowbars! :ugly:

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Jinx
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Tue Mar 27, 2012 12:22 pm

gaspard wrote:
ardent wrote:Sledgehammer is too powerful a weapon to appear this early in the game. But if somebody did the club animations for the tribal critter, there could be clubs. :mhmm:
Red crowbars! :ugly:
Crowbars got a pretty badass damage (3-10), but a wrench would work (3-6) or a club would fit even better (1-6).
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HighwayChile
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Wed May 16, 2012 3:38 am

Hi guys,

Want to first of all start off by saying congratulations on all the hard work that's obviously gone into modding this fantastic game!

I hadn't played Fallout or any of the series until very recently *hangs head in shame*. I heard about this project from cp himself (he oversaw a lab of mine a few months back) - and have to say the Demo of 2011 plays really well and the attention to detail in both visual/scripting aspects is very impressive! I'm still in the process of trying to complete the demo so will give any more feedback as and when!

Keep up the great work!

Alex

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